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Yuri Andropov and Operation Spider Web "

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Progonoziruyu seen in the leaders' second opinion. "
But, I think, discuss on the topic interesting.

In 1982, the power in the country was Yuri Andropov, who headed the KGB 15 years, and he decided to make a loud demonstration work to eradicate corruption in the USSR:
QUOTE
Yeliseyevsky grocery store was in those years, the point where the system orders and the "back door" merchandised all higher nomenclature and cultural elite of the capital. Here you can get scarce alcoholic beverages, imported cigarettes, caviar, chocolates, canned goods and other delicacies. Officials, artists, generals, and astronauts got into Eliseevskiy cherished products, not forgetting to "thank" the director. A director Eliseevsky, Sokolov, in turn, used the links to "get" the intricacies of "bins homeland" is necessary. Roughly the same system works and numerous branches of deli ...
The money and promised to barter services flowed upward - to the curators of Sokolov. Among them were high-ranking functionaries: Head of Trade Nicholas Tregubov Moscow City, Moscow City Executive Committee Chairman Vladimir Promyslov, Viktor Grishin (first secretary of the Moscow Party Committee and member of the Politburo), Galina Brezhnev (Leonid Brezhnev's daughter), liquor (a member of the Politburo) and others. ..
Following Sokolov had been arrested and other leaders of the major metropolitan shopping and food, "officials said. As part of the investigative authorities instigated the operational affairs of the web of accumulated dozens of volumes of corruption. According to these documents that the State had caused enormous damage at the time of 3 million rubles. And the amount of bribes received more than 1,5 million rubles ...
After his arrest, bribe-takers in the KGB began to come bags of letters demanding to punish the snickering merchant.
The Supreme Court of the RSFSR Yuri Sokolov sentenced to capital punishment, the sentence was executed on Dec. 14, 1984 It is believed that the former director was shot in a paddy wagon on the way to the detention izolyator.Tregubov was sentenced to 15 years, and the other defendants were sentenced to various terms of very serious ...


Co Andropov's death, the fight against corruption went on toromza.
So if there were chances to stop the collapse of social services such measures. economy and the Union of??

This post has been edited by Format C on 19.10.2010 - 20:28


There were chances. If Andropov revealed the treacherous nature of Yakovlev, Gorbachev, Yeltsin, Volkogonov, etc.

This post has been edited by Sorques on 04.10.2010 - 12:08


And that would have changed the economy from a few landings? The system was broken long before Andropov. Populist measures to restore order and discipline could not give anything.


QUOTE (Sorques@04.10.2010 - Time: 12:12)
And that would have changed the economy from a few landings?

Would not have been in the late 80's to dig into the land of meat-products and rot in warehouses other products, creating an artificial famine and shortage, pointing people to what brought socialism. Would not have to dial to borrow money and shove about their pockets, creating a huge national debt and artificially approximate the country to bankruptcy.

QUOTE
The system was broken long before Andropov. Populist measures to restore order and discipline could not give anything.

Long? Figures prove it?


QUOTE (Format C@04.10.2010 - Time: 06:14)
In 1982, the power in the country was Yuri Andropov, who headed the KGB 15 years, and he decided to make a loud demonstration work to eradicate corruption in the USSR:

Actually, you very first post answered the question.
Resounding show of it.
Although Andropov even as the head of the Committee had enough leverage to extrude such here Sokolov bundles.
Say that the fight against corruption after Andropov's death ended - is fundamentally wrong. Because it can not stop something that does not even begin


QUOTE (Crazy Ivan@04.10.2010 - Time: 13:03)
QUOTE (Sorques@04.10.2010 - Time: 12:12)
And that would have changed the economy from a few landings?

Would not have been in the late 80's to dig into the land of meat-products and rot in warehouses other products, creating an artificial famine and shortage, pointing people to what brought socialism. Would not have to dial to borrow money and shove about their pockets, creating a huge national debt and artificially approximate the country to bankruptcy.

QUOTE
The system was broken long before Andropov. Populist measures to restore order and discipline could not give anything.

Long? Figures prove it?

Victor are you laughing? We're already four years the same mole ... All the figures, arguments, facts, I like you. and I've already laid out a long time. We begin a new cycle? Write down the type of bullet ... 00003.gif


QUOTE (Sorques@04.10.2010 - Time: 14:13)

Victor are you laughing? We're already four years the same mole ... All the figures, arguments, facts, I like you. and I've already laid out a long time. We begin a new cycle? Write down the type of bullet ... :

No, not the same thing. I want to see the figures showing the imminent death of socialism and the USSR in the Andropov period.


This post has been edited by Crazy Ivan on 04.10.2010 - 16:49


QUOTE
Be the first one similar post answered the question.
Resounding show of it ...


demonstration, yes - but not "window dressing":
beat verily not to scapegoat

This post has been edited by Format C on 04.10.2010 - 20:55


QUOTE (Crazy Ivan)
No, not the same thing. I want to see the figures showing the imminent death of socialism and the USSR in the Andropov period


Oh, I would have looked with interest at the numbers:
say, 1960, 1970 and 1982 - on the provision of housing, food, manufactured goods and cars
and how this provision in the USSR correlated c cap. countries.
that is where we moved.
but such figures can not find

This post has been edited by Format C on 05.10.2010 - 00:28


QUOTE (Format C@05.10.2010 - Time: 00:25)

and how this provision in the USSR correlated c cap. countries.
that is where we moved.
but such figures can not find


Now you write, though with some countries compare!, and compared with the Upper Volta 00003.gif


QUOTE (Format C@04.10.2010 - Time: 19:17)

demonstration, yes - but not "window dressing":
beat verily not to scapegoat

Why? That's the switchman. Director Eliseevsky also not my fault that certain goods have been a deficit, even exemplary Moscow.

QUOTE
and how this provision in the USSR correlated c cap. countries.

Let's count up. If the USSR is constantly sought to catch up and overtake America, the standard of living was clearly lower than in the United States and, accordingly, lower than in countries where the standard of living which was higher than in the U.S..

This post has been edited by zLoyyyy on 08.10.2010 - 00:02


QUOTE (zLoyyyy@08.10.2010 - Time: 00:00)
Director Eliseevsky also not my fault that certain goods have been a deficit, even exemplary Moscow.

Him in this, no one blamed.

QUOTE
Let's count up. If the USSR is constantly sought to catch up and overtake America, the standard of living was clearly lower than in the United States and, accordingly, lower than in countries where the standard of living which was higher than in the U.S..

The fact that the level was lower, does not constitute grounds for believing that the USSR was doomed to collapse.

This post has been edited by Crazy Ivan on 08.10.2010 - 00:05


QUOTE (Crazy Ivan@08.10.2010 - Time: 00:03)
QUOTE (zLoyyyy@08.10.2010 - Time: 00:00)
Director Eliseevsky also not my fault that certain goods have been a deficit, even exemplary Moscow.

Him in this, no one blamed.


Of course. Blame should have been those on whose fault actually existed deficit. For example, theorists of Marxism-Leninism, which built the Capital, the rank of divine revelation, not to be questioned. But this did not happen. Went to court the people who, generally speaking, nothing to blame.


QUOTE
The fact that the level was lower, does not constitute grounds for believing that the USSR was doomed to collapse.

Agreed. Rather, it was reason to suspect that something is wrong in the country with the world's best soil, the richest mineral resources and the latest intelligence.


QUOTE (zLoyyyy@08.10.2010 - Time: 00:18)

Of course. Blame should have been those on whose fault actually existed deficit. For example, theorists of Marxism-Leninism, which built the Capital, the rank of divine revelation, not to be questioned. But this did not happen. Went to court the people who, generally speaking, nothing to blame.

Director Eliseevsky store shot for huge bribes. Now this is called corruption. If it is to justify, referring to the system permitted the deficit, then no wonder today and corruption. Officials not to blame for the fact that the system created for them the motivation to bribes. What do you approach them trailer?



QUOTE (Format C@05.10.2010 - Time: 00:25)
QUOTE (Crazy Ivan)
No, not the same thing. I want to see the figures showing the imminent death of socialism and the USSR in the Andropov period


Oh, I would have looked with interest at the numbers:
say, 1960, 1970 and 1982 - on the provision of housing, food, manufactured goods and cars
and how this provision in the USSR correlated c cap. countries.
that is where we moved.
but such figures can not find

Well, why do all you can find. Just a lot of fuss ... 00064.gif

The total floor space per person in square meters. m (1970/1980/1990 gg.)

Great. - 19.5 / 27.5 / 34.5
Germany - 18.5 / 32.5 / 41.5
France - 21.0 / 34.5 / 40.0
USA - 36.0 / 46.5 / 51.0
RSFSR - 11.5 / 13.5 / 16.5

Cars per 1000 inh. (1970/1980/1990 gg.)

Great. - 214/277/360
Germany - 194/330/447
France - 234/354/415
RSFSR - 6/30/59

According to the U.S. as of those dates have not found the data, but there are others.

1938 - 231 cars per 1000 inh.
1984 - 700 cars per 1000 inh. 00003.gif

There is still a very significant data demonstrating the gulf in the level of development and living standards between the USSR and the leading Western countries, particularly the U.S.. So, in 1983 in the United States appeared million cellular subscribers, in the USSR, they did not exist! In 1985, the U.S. only domashnik computers were already 17 million, while in the scoop - less than 0,1 million of ALL, and home were virtually absent as a class. In 1985, VCRs were present in 46% of American households and less than 1% - the Soviets. You can continue indefinitely ... 00064.gif


QUOTE
Blame should have been those on whose fault actually existed deficit. For example, theorists of Marxism-Leninism, which built the "Capital" ...

on those in the 89-year snapped up in unison -
and even the cotton case, which led Gdlyan and Ivanov, was elevated to the rank at the criminal and political crimes -
Having reported registry so that the people of victories sotsializama in the fields of the country.

And with Sokolov / Tregubov case, however, purely criminal, and left.

This post has been edited by Format C on 08.10.2010 - 18:10


QUOTE (Crazy Ivan@08.10.2010 - Time: 00:33)

Director Eliseevsky store shot for huge bribes. Now this is called corruption. If it is to justify, referring to the system permitted the deficit, then no wonder today and corruption. Officials not to blame for the fact that the system created for them the motivation to bribes. What do you approach them trailer?


Sorry, but I do not think that the director of deli can be classified as public officials.

Store manager exists in the system, in which he exists, not being part of it, and state officials that is the system itself.

Thirdly, I, in fact, does not justify the store manager because he had violated existing at the time the Soviet laws, however debility they would not have been, and formally he was to blame. I responded to the invitation, which said in effect that in this process were the main culprits punished, not the small fry.

Store manager was just a small fry, which was faced with the choice to sell himself French cognac member of the Writers through the anus, or throw it on the counter, where it will be bought up what some retirees, or parasites and sold by the same members of the Writers' Union in the same speculative price.

Third option might not be in Moscow, which, relatively speaking, there was a demand for a thousand bottles of Courvoisier in the day, and a planned economy could provide only a hundred, because the director could not Eliseevsky own contract with the supplier of brandy, and in Vsesoyuzspirtoplode, which was the only legal importer of booze in the Union were such Novoseltseva, which are more concerned about what, where "to get 20 rubles to pay" than the situation with cognac in Moscow.


Hoping that it will not get caught, but Andropov took high-profile case ... no luck.


zLoyyyy, corruption / bribery exist in any system - a criminal act,
and its organizers - the criminal ringleaders.

QUOTE (Bruno69)
Well, why do all you can find. Just a lot of fuss ...

Exactly. Statistics - business chore. And there will always be neveryaschie requiring "reliable sources", etc.


This post has been edited by Format C on 08.10.2010 - 18:24


QUOTE (Format C@05.10.2010 - Time: 00:25)
Oh, I would have looked with interest at the numbers:
say, 1960, 1970 and 1982 - on the provision of housing, food, manufactured goods and cars
and how this provision in the USSR correlated c cap. countries.
that is where we moved.
but such figures can not find

Yeah, we ought to look. Only what is given - it's not all. Do not forget to even compare the amount of resources directly or indirectly controlled by the relevant countries (mineral deposits, the amount of land suitable for agriculture, etc., etc.), and to ensure comparability. That is not to compare the provision of housing in general, and the provision of heated shelter, not just the amount of land suitable for agriculture, and separately the amount of land available for processing throughout the year, within 9 months of the year, etc. etc. That's when interesting things oooooochen vylezut. A simple comparison of only confuses the picture - they say, good Americans have built thousands of homes anywhere in Florida, and the evil communists one hundred homes somewhere in Vorkuta - that is, neobepechennost accommodation for you! About the fact that the house fit for habitation in Florida, and the house livable in Vorkuta (yes there in Vorkuta, even in the same town) - are two big differences are usually silent. Thus here and draw the great achievements of the West versus the Soviet Union.

This post has been edited by on 10.10.2010 - 13:00


QUOTE (Markiz@10.10.2010 - Time: 12:59)
QUOTE (Format C@05.10.2010 - Time: 00:25)
Oh, I would have looked with interest at the numbers:
say, 1960, 1970 and 1982 - on the provision of housing, food, manufactured goods and cars
and how this provision in the USSR correlated c cap. countries.
that is where we moved.
but such figures can not find

Yeah, we ought to look. Only what is given - it's not all. Do not forget to even compare the amount of resources directly or indirectly controlled by the relevant countries (mineral deposits, the amount of land suitable for agriculture, etc., etc.), and to ensure comparability. That is not to compare the provision of housing in general, and the provision of heated shelter, not just the amount of land suitable for agriculture, and separately the amount of land available for processing throughout the year, within 9 months of the year, etc. etc. That's when interesting things oooooochen vylezut. A simple comparison of only confuses the picture - they say, good Americans have built thousands of homes anywhere in Florida, and the evil communists one hundred homes somewhere in Vorkuta - that is, neobepechennost accommodation for you! About the fact that the house fit for habitation in Florida, and the house livable in Vorkuta (yes there in Vorkuta, even in the same town) - are two big differences are usually silent. Thus here and draw the great achievements of the West versus the Soviet Union.

Well, compare the Soviet Union, Canada, Finland and Sweden, Th tongue-wag is wasted? Just the look of your favorite scoop would be just as pale! Because the difference in living standards and consumption levels are as enormous as the temperature or the resources no longer reproached, because the average temperature settings in Canada is even worse than in Russia, not to mention the Soviet Union, stretching far to the south and which had a vast zone of the subtropics. 00050.gif

As the next lecture in the subject a little remark about Vorkuta. There is such a scientific test - Temperature per capita (TPC). In Canada, it is slightly higher than in Russia, despite the more severe conditions in the country's average. So thankful your adorable Bolshevik and personally beloved Comrade Stalin's mediocrity. This is their "merit" that in Russia there was the vast population in the regions with the extremely harsh climate. Where practical, the Canadians would create small towns with population shifts, solely for the extraction of raw materials, which is nrerabatyvaetsya in southern latitudes, these sheep otgrohali using slave labor gulagovtsev tremendous cities such as Norilsk and Vorkuta with a permanent population, are forced to live in extreme conditions. As a result, if in the early 20 th century TDN Russia and Canada were virtually identical in 1930, when Bolshevik started to do his own idiocy, the difference was 1.5 degrees, then by 1990 it reached 4.5 degrees. But what is most sad for you because any of the apologists geodeterminizma, and this difference is easily removable (which is in the 21 century has substantially decreased due to an outflow of people from Russia's north) is not essential and could not explain the immense difference in the level of development and living standards between Canada and Russia. 00064.gif

Can Treyvish and Tsirel for the overall development of reading, a very good visual aids.

This post has been edited by Bruno1969 on 10.10.2010 - 14:27


Canada can afford it, to concentrate in the Great Lakes and along the U.S. coast of the oceans. The remaining area can not equip. They are in Canada, half the population of Ukraine, and half of them are Ukrainians. And we need to resettle people.


QUOTE (Crazy Ivan@10.10.2010 - Time: 15:04)
Canada can afford it, to concentrate in the Great Lakes and along the U.S. coast of the oceans. The remaining area can not equip. They are in Canada, half the population of Ukraine, and half of them are Ukrainians. And we need to resettle people.

Whatever the phrase - the gem of ignorance! 00003.gif One of the largest cities in Canada, Winnipeg, albeit at a latitude of Kiev in January where the average temperature of -19 (all in Moscow -9)! And Canada has no sub-tropical, like the Russian Black Sea coast! Canada's population 33 million, Ukraine - 46. Moreover, the whole Canada is less than the Asian part of Russia, and the population, unlike in Ukraine and Russia grows quickly, in 2025, according to the forecast there will be live already 38 million Russia easily could concentrate all their 140 million (in 2025 will be completely 129) ONLY in the European part, only in relatively warm parts of it, and the population density in this case would be about as in Latvia and significantly lower than in Lithuania! Although in this and there is no need. It is only necessary to resettle the surplus, driven in harsh climatic conditions. But even without that Russia is fully capable to secure a very normal stage of development and life. If we compare the current property rates to the Soviet, then it turns out that Russia is fairly "warmer". 00051.gif

This post has been edited by Bruno1969 on 10.10.2010 - 17:37


QUOTE (Format C@08.10.2010 - Time: 18:12)
zLoyyyy, corruption / bribery exist in any system - a criminal act,
and its organizers - the criminal ringleaders.


Yes. But Sokolov leader was not. I understand that those with whom he had "worked" was far above that of their social status.

By the way, given your text in the header post is not entirely clear to give or take bribes Sokolov. If you give, for what purpose, if you take it, for what?

This post has been edited by zLoyyyy on 10.10.2010 - 17:05


QUOTE (Bruno1969@10.10.2010 - Time: 13:58)


As the next lecture in the subject a little remark about Vorkuta. There is such a scientific test - Temperature per capita (TPC). In Canada, it is slightly higher than in Russia, despite the more severe conditions in the country's average. So thankful your adorable Bolshevik and personally beloved Comrade Stalin's mediocrity. This is their "merit" that in Russia there was the vast population in the regions with the extremely harsh climate. Where practical, the Canadians would create small towns with population shifts, solely for the extraction of raw materials, which are processed in the southern latitudes, these sheep otgrohali using slave labor gulagovtsev tremendous cities such as Norilsk and Vorkuta with a permanent population, are forced to live in extreme conditions.

Well enough to lie a frankly. Your favorite Sudbury now 15, and in Norilsk today -18. Sudbury has a three-hour drive from the Great Lakes, and Norilsk in the three-hour flight from Krasnoyarsk. Well what the fuck comparison. That's the great Estonian economists!


QUOTE (muse 55@10.10.2010 - Time: 19:26)
QUOTE (Bruno1969@10.10.2010 - Time: 13:58)


As the next lecture in the subject a little remark about Vorkuta. There is such a scientific test - Temperature per capita (TPC). In Canada, it is slightly higher than in Russia, despite the more severe conditions in the country's average. So thankful your adorable Bolshevik and personally beloved Comrade Stalin's mediocrity. This is their "merit" that in Russia there was the vast population in the regions with the extremely harsh climate. Where practical, the Canadians would create small towns with population shifts, solely for the extraction of raw materials, which are processed in the southern latitudes, these sheep otgrohali using slave labor gulagovtsev tremendous cities such as Norilsk and Vorkuta with a permanent population, are forced to live in extreme conditions.

Well enough to lie a frankly. Your favorite Sudbury now 15, and in Norilsk today -18. Sudbury has a three-hour drive from the Great Lakes, and Norilsk in the three-hour flight from Krasnoyarsk. Well what the fuck comparison. That's the great Estonian economists!

What does the Sudbury?? Where have I lied about it, I did not even mention it here. 00069.gif And what have the Sudbury to Norilsk?? The fact of the matter is that much better climatic conditions Sudbury Canadians are twice smaller city than otgrohali for some reason the Polar Norilsk advice. Although originally the plans were quite reasonable - a small mining town with a population shifts, but raw material to process in the south to other cities with a normal climate. 00050.gif

With the same success can be compared to Sochi and Churchill, for example. 00051.gif

This post has been edited by Bruno1969 on 10.10.2010 - 19:41


QUOTE (Bruno1969@10.10.2010 - Time: 19:35)

What does the Sudbury?? Where have I lied about it, I did not even mention it here. 00069.gif And what have the Sudbury to Norilsk?? 00050.gif

With the same success can be compared to Sochi and Churchill, for example. 00051.gif

Memory otshiblo? Remember their advice on development of the North on a rotational basis.


QUOTE (muse 55@10.10.2010 - Time: 19:41)
QUOTE (Bruno1969@10.10.2010 - Time: 19:35)

What does the Sudbury?? Where have I lied about it, I did not even mention it here. 00069.gif And what have the Sudbury to Norilsk?? 00050.gif

With the same success can be compared to Sochi and Churchill, for example. 00051.gif

Memory otshiblo? Remember their advice on development of the North on a rotational basis.

So what?? What is the relationship with the Sudbury and where is the lie? In my opinion, the problem is not in my memory, as in yours, together with your obsessive fantasies.

ZY addition in the post above about Sudbury, you seem to have missed.

This post has been edited by Bruno1969 on 10.10.2010 - 19:50


QUOTE (Bruno1969@10.10.2010 - Time: 19:35)
. Although originally the plans were quite reasonable - a small mining town with a population shifts, but raw material to process in the south to other cities with a normal climate.


In what the South were plans to process raw materials? In Krasnoyarsk? Navigation on the Yenisei River just 5 months at best.


QUOTE (muse 55@10.10.2010 - Time: 20:19)
QUOTE (Bruno1969@10.10.2010 - Time: 19:35)
. Although originally the plans were quite reasonable - a small mining town with a population shifts, but raw material to process in the south to other cities with a normal climate.


In what the South were plans to process raw materials? In Krasnoyarsk? Navigation on the Yenisei River just 5 months at best.

You have not yet responded to me for his irresponsible General Discussion.

QUOTE
QUOTE
As the next lecture in the subject a little remark about Vorkuta. There is such a scientific test - Temperature per capita (TPC). In Canada, it is slightly higher than in Russia, despite the more severe conditions in the country's average. So thankful your adorable Bolshevik and personally beloved Comrade Stalin's mediocrity. This is their "merit" that in Russia there was the vast population in the regions with the extremely harsh climate. Where practical, the Canadians would create small towns with population shifts, solely for the extraction of raw materials, which are processed in the southern latitudes, these sheep otgrohali using slave labor gulagovtsev tremendous cities such as Norilsk and Vorkuta with a permanent population, are forced to live in extreme conditions.

Well enough to lie a frankly.


Where's the lie? Or, again, sorry it will merge? 00050.gif

About 5 months of navigation is the more ignorant nonsense. 00051.gif Yes, even 1 month! Raw materials collected in the warehouses, and then safely transported to the navigation period. Straight binomial theorem! 00050.gif


QUOTE (Bruno1969@10.10.2010 - Time: 20:26)


About 5 months of navigation is the more ignorant nonsense. 00051.gif Yes, even 1 month! Raw materials collected in the warehouses, and then safely transported to the navigation period. Straight binomial theorem! 00050.gif

This scale Estonia nonsense. A 15 million tons of ore transported from Norilsk to Krasnoyarsk is not crap? Unload, reload a few times? Finished nickel from Dudinka sea can take immediately to London, and from Krasnoyarsk, where? By the way of this ore will nickel and copper in the forty times less weight. This is a proud carriage of Estonia can be ignored. If we consider that the processing of this ore is used Norilsk as coal and gas, the savings is just obvious. I do not remember where, I read. that the cost of Norilsk Nickel is obtained about 5 thousand dollars per ton. Lowest in the world. True, honest, myself believe in it with difficulty. A platinum group metals (those that do not steal and not get in Estonia) is actually processed in Krasnoyarsk.
You are a prisoner of his Estonian microeconomics.


QUOTE (Bruno1969@10.10.2010 - Time: 20:26)


About 5 months of navigation is the more ignorant nonsense.

And what is this nonsense? Yes more ignorant? I can not believe that this short?
And it is in the best case. And can be easily and four months. And for it shipped 1.5 million tons of freight Norilsk CC. And you simply increase the volume of traffic by 10 times. This is not the same. that increase the volume of beer sold in bars in Tallinn at the expense of a low bow: "What would you like?"

This post has been edited by JFK2006 on 10.10.2010 - 22:35


Gentlemen, are you talking about? Subject something about the fight against corruption Andropov!
Stop flooding!


Bruno1969, you'll be back later to complain that you were harassed as well?
What does Canada have to try to Andropov to fight corruption in the USSR?


QUOTE (JFK2006@10.10.2010 - Time: 22:38)
Bruno1969, you'll be back later to complain that you were harassed as well?
What does Canada have to try to Andropov to fight corruption in the USSR?

No, I will not complain. I've long been accustomed to the fact that you have become a scapegoat for any departure from the party line ... topic, although it begins as a rule, very NOT WITH ME! .


QUOTE (JFK2006)
What does Canada have to try to Andropov to fight corruption in the USSR?

this question makes it possible for a dispute arose about the state of Andropov during the Soviet economy, which is mentioned in the questionnaire of the topic and which should be evaluated in comparison with the developed cap. countries ... Well, not to Madagascar, in fact, to compare.
And in Canada, in fact, the most populous parts thereof ("corridor of Quebec City - Windsor) climatic conditions are similar to the European part of Russia - that is all the same that go from Tver to Rostov.
But I have all the same no objective statistics on the 80 th year either in Canada or in Russia - only a subjective opinion on newspaper articles and other media.

This post has been edited by Format C on 11.10.2010 - 04:59


QUOTE (zLoyyyy)
Sokolov was not a ringleader. I understand that those with whom he had "worked" was far above that of their social status.
By the way, given your text in the header post is not entirely clear to give or take bribes Sokolov. If you give, for what purpose, if you take it, for what?

Sokolov gave bribes to the Department of Trade Moskispolkoma that would get in your supermarket (or more precisely, a network of supermarkets), scarce food,
and administers the system of collecting bribes from retail buyers.

In Moscow, there were other grocery retailers, who were also not angels, but the largest breaches occurred in the Eliseevskiy "

In order to cover the Sokolov-handed, investigators had a long painstaking preliminary work, thoroughly examining all the links in "chain of violations," and not touching the privates bribes .... Then, one day (which was, in essence, a private day trading Eliseevskiy), a supermarket, was thrown out this Desan operatives, all cash and trade operations are stopped, immediately in front of customers, began a comparison of the goods on the documents with the actual presence goods on the shelves, etc.

-

But ... IMHO, with Sokolov cost is not quite reasonable, I mean "tower" and the immediate execution -
He actively testified to investigators and those hodatoystvovali NOT apply to him, "supreme measure."
In protivopopolozhnost him Tregubov (head of the Moscow department of trade), he denied everything, did not render assistance to the investigation and was sentenced to 15 years, of whom actually sat for seven years.
Type, showed the future of suspects "how to behave."

This post has been edited by Format C on 11.10.2010 - 05:32


QUOTE (Format C@11.10.2010 - Time: 01:07)
QUOTE (JFK2006)
What does Canada have to try to Andropov to fight corruption in the USSR?

this question makes it possible for a dispute arose about the state of Andropov during the Soviet economy, which is mentioned in the questionnaire of the topic and which should be evaluated in comparison with the developed cap. countries ... Well, not to Madagascar, in fact, to compare.
And in Canada, in fact, the most populous parts thereof ("corridor of Quebec City - Windsor) climatic conditions are similar to the European part of Russia - that is all the same that go from Tver to Rostov.
But I have all the same no objective statistics on the 80 th year either in Canada or in Russia - only a subjective opinion on newspaper articles and other media.

"Co Andropov's death, the fight against corruption went on toromza.
So if there were chances to stop the collapse of social services such measures. economy and the Union of??
"- that is the question topic.

The main thing, as I understand it, the relationship of corruption and economic collapse. Or am I mistaken?

And about what, why and how the USSR collapsed, we already have a theme.
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Yuri Andropov and Operation Spider Web "

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